<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
	xmlns:georss="http://www.georss.org/georss" xmlns:geo="http://www.w3.org/2003/01/geo/wgs84_pos#" xmlns:media="http://search.yahoo.com/mrss/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Apologia Pro Correlation Sua</title>
	<atom:link href="http://bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/10/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/10/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/</link>
	<description>A Mormon Blog</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 09:39:41 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.com/</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Glenn</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/10/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80080</link>
		<dc:creator>Glenn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Jun 2007 19:08:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80080</guid>
		<description>My first thought was the same as Kevin&#039;s -- McDonalds baby.  But even the McDonalds here in Japan sells curry rice from time to time -- and Ronald is called Donald McDonald (because of the Japanese difficulty with &quot;r&quot;).  So they still allow for some regional/cultural variation.

But I really didn&#039;t know much about the correlation efforts until I got into the Blogernacle a few months ago.  How many times has something like this happened in Church history?  It seems that something similar happened in Kirtland when Jospeh tried to put a stop to all the uncontrolable charismatic manifestations (speaking in tongues, etc).  I would also be interested to go back and look at the folklore record to see how -- if at all -- the correlation effected folk transmition

And BTW Mark -- &quot;The dead language grammar Nazi?&quot;  Really?  I thought the recent BCC correlation had but the axe on these kinds of handles.  Ah -- sigh.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My first thought was the same as Kevin&#8217;s &#8212; McDonalds baby.  But even the McDonalds here in Japan sells curry rice from time to time &#8212; and Ronald is called Donald McDonald (because of the Japanese difficulty with &#8220;r&#8221;).  So they still allow for some regional/cultural variation.</p>
<p>But I really didn&#8217;t know much about the correlation efforts until I got into the Blogernacle a few months ago.  How many times has something like this happened in Church history?  It seems that something similar happened in Kirtland when Jospeh tried to put a stop to all the uncontrolable charismatic manifestations (speaking in tongues, etc).  I would also be interested to go back and look at the folklore record to see how &#8212; if at all &#8212; the correlation effected folk transmition</p>
<p>And BTW Mark &#8212; &#8220;The dead language grammar Nazi?&#8221;  Really?  I thought the recent BCC correlation had but the axe on these kinds of handles.  Ah &#8212; sigh.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Deep Sea</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/10/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80079</link>
		<dc:creator>Deep Sea</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 12 Jun 2007 00:14:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80079</guid>
		<description>Yi-Fu Tuan is a geographer, not an anthropologist.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yi-Fu Tuan is a geographer, not an anthropologist.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: a random John</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/10/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80078</link>
		<dc:creator>a random John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jun 2007 19:05:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80078</guid>
		<description>Lessons suffer from the Peter Principle somewhat.  Those that know their stuff and are good teachers tend to get promoted to other callings in which they do not teach often.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lessons suffer from the Peter Principle somewhat.  Those that know their stuff and are good teachers tend to get promoted to other callings in which they do not teach often.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ugly Mahana</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/10/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80077</link>
		<dc:creator>Ugly Mahana</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jun 2007 18:51:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80077</guid>
		<description>Re: 15

Thus the fourth sunday lesson in Priesthood and Relief Society. And, each Conference Ensign contains a list of talks organized by topic for the youth. At least, as I recall.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Re: 15</p>
<p>Thus the fourth sunday lesson in Priesthood and Relief Society. And, each Conference Ensign contains a list of talks organized by topic for the youth. At least, as I recall.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Bob</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/10/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80076</link>
		<dc:creator>Bob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jun 2007 16:07:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80076</guid>
		<description>Maybe the thing that bothers me is not the common content, but the content itself.  Our gospel doctrine lesson yesterday mainly quoted Bruce R McConkie, who has been dead for nearly 25 years.  The most recent quote was from the 90s.  It would be great to hear what our current leaders have to say on these scriptures.  I remember some of the Old Testament lessons last year that quoted Marion G Romney extensively and wondered what the younger members of the class thought.  I have a BIC son in college and Marion G Romney was before my time.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maybe the thing that bothers me is not the common content, but the content itself.  Our gospel doctrine lesson yesterday mainly quoted Bruce R McConkie, who has been dead for nearly 25 years.  The most recent quote was from the 90s.  It would be great to hear what our current leaders have to say on these scriptures.  I remember some of the Old Testament lessons last year that quoted Marion G Romney extensively and wondered what the younger members of the class thought.  I have a BIC son in college and Marion G Romney was before my time.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ray</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/10/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80075</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jun 2007 04:28:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80075</guid>
		<description>A forum like this helps tremendously, but why can&#039;t you have study groups?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A forum like this helps tremendously, but why can&#8217;t you have study groups?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Bored in Vernal</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/10/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80074</link>
		<dc:creator>Bored in Vernal</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jun 2007 04:12:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80074</guid>
		<description>&lt;em&gt;If someone is looking for deeply nuanced and intellectually stimulating lessons, then most church meetings are not going to fit that description.&lt;/em&gt;
I understand this, but I wonder why then, that we can&#039;t have study groups?  Or why Institute can&#039;t be a bit more meaty?  Because those members who _are_ looking for something more intellectually stimulating are being driven to other churches&#039; &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.nine-moons.com/2007/06/09/non-mormon-bible-study-scratches-me-where-i-itch/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Bible studies&lt;/a&gt;!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><em>If someone is looking for deeply nuanced and intellectually stimulating lessons, then most church meetings are not going to fit that description.</em><br />
I understand this, but I wonder why then, that we can&#8217;t have study groups?  Or why Institute can&#8217;t be a bit more meaty?  Because those members who _are_ looking for something more intellectually stimulating are being driven to other churches&#8217; <a href="http://www.nine-moons.com/2007/06/09/non-mormon-bible-study-scratches-me-where-i-itch/" rel="nofollow">Bible studies</a>!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ray</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/10/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80073</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jun 2007 02:15:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80073</guid>
		<description>#11: None whatsoever, if &quot;the same all over the church&quot; means the same basic foundation, not the exact same word-for-word final product.  The more closely a teacher comes to reading the lesson from the manual, particularly while limiting class involvement, the more correlation equals poor quality lessons.  It is the quality of the teacher that determines the quality of the lesson (and the willingness of the student(s) to look intently for new insight even in the face of a bad teacher), and the quality of the teacher depends on both an understanding of the material AND the ability to teach by the Spirit - both to touch hearts AND to ascertain where to take any given lesson.

If correlation were to blame, we wouldn&#039;t have poor Sacrament Meeting talks - only poor lessons.

Having said that, it is important to add one qualifier: If someone is looking for deeply nuanced and intellectually stimulating lessons, then most church meetings are not going to fit that description.  (I have had some Gospel Doctrine teachers who were amazing, but even some of their lessons have been hijacked into mediocrity.)  I have been in quite a few that were both nuanced and stimulating, but they usually were limited in attendance and self-selected in some way. They were NOT general meetings open to any average member, where incredible diversity of understanding is the norm.  Correlation in these more narrow meetings would be pointless and disastrous.

I participate here and in selective circles (and by relishing the written word) to gain nuance and intellectual insight.  I don&#039;t go to ward meetings to do so.  I go there to have my spirit lifted, and, frankly, that happens to some degree almost every week - at least once and usually multiple times, even when not one talk or lessons would be considered close to professional.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>#11: None whatsoever, if &#8220;the same all over the church&#8221; means the same basic foundation, not the exact same word-for-word final product.  The more closely a teacher comes to reading the lesson from the manual, particularly while limiting class involvement, the more correlation equals poor quality lessons.  It is the quality of the teacher that determines the quality of the lesson (and the willingness of the student(s) to look intently for new insight even in the face of a bad teacher), and the quality of the teacher depends on both an understanding of the material AND the ability to teach by the Spirit &#8211; both to touch hearts AND to ascertain where to take any given lesson.</p>
<p>If correlation were to blame, we wouldn&#8217;t have poor Sacrament Meeting talks &#8211; only poor lessons.</p>
<p>Having said that, it is important to add one qualifier: If someone is looking for deeply nuanced and intellectually stimulating lessons, then most church meetings are not going to fit that description.  (I have had some Gospel Doctrine teachers who were amazing, but even some of their lessons have been hijacked into mediocrity.)  I have been in quite a few that were both nuanced and stimulating, but they usually were limited in attendance and self-selected in some way. They were NOT general meetings open to any average member, where incredible diversity of understanding is the norm.  Correlation in these more narrow meetings would be pointless and disastrous.</p>
<p>I participate here and in selective circles (and by relishing the written word) to gain nuance and intellectual insight.  I don&#8217;t go to ward meetings to do so.  I go there to have my spirit lifted, and, frankly, that happens to some degree almost every week &#8211; at least once and usually multiple times, even when not one talk or lessons would be considered close to professional.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Julie M. Smith</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/10/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80072</link>
		<dc:creator>Julie M. Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 Jun 2007 01:51:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80072</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m wondering about the assumption that

correlation = poor quality lessons

Is there a reason why we can&#039;t have thought-provoking, easy to teach, stimulating lessons . . . that are the same all over the church?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m wondering about the assumption that</p>
<p>correlation = poor quality lessons</p>
<p>Is there a reason why we can&#8217;t have thought-provoking, easy to teach, stimulating lessons . . . that are the same all over the church?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Mark IV</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/10/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80071</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark IV</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 Jun 2007 21:35:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/2007/06/apologia-pro-correlation-sua/#comment-80071</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;Mark, Iâ€™m shocked! Following the preposition pro, the ablative case is required, and correlation is clearly a Latin feminine of the third declension. So, please: pro correlation&lt;strong&gt;e&lt;/strong&gt; sua.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Dear Br. or Sr. Nazi, as the case may be:

Sorry for the shock, and I&#039;m happy to acknowledge that of course you are absolutely correct.  Nonetheless, the title as it now stands, with its mixed up cases and incorrect declensions, reminds me of my younger self when I was serving a mission, and therefore has a certain sentimental appeal.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>Mark, Iâ€™m shocked! Following the preposition pro, the ablative case is required, and correlation is clearly a Latin feminine of the third declension. So, please: pro correlation<strong>e</strong> sua.</p></blockquote>
<p>Dear Br. or Sr. Nazi, as the case may be:</p>
<p>Sorry for the shock, and I&#8217;m happy to acknowledge that of course you are absolutely correct.  Nonetheless, the title as it now stands, with its mixed up cases and incorrect declensions, reminds me of my younger self when I was serving a mission, and therefore has a certain sentimental appeal.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
