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	<title>Comments on: Political speech to believe in</title>
	<atom:link href="http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/08/13/political-speech-to-believe-in/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/08/13/political-speech-to-believe-in/</link>
	<description>A Mormon Blog</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Paradox</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/08/13/political-speech-to-believe-in/#comment-43738</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Paradox]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Aug 2008 05:29:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/?p=4059#comment-43738</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Look mom! It&#039;s change we can believe in...

oh wait....]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Look mom! It&#8217;s change we can believe in&#8230;</p>
<p>oh wait&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Anon.</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/08/13/political-speech-to-believe-in/#comment-43737</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Anon.]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Aug 2008 12:04:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/?p=4059#comment-43737</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Watched this recently.  That speech is the best part of the film (which was about 20 minutes too long).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Watched this recently.  That speech is the best part of the film (which was about 20 minutes too long).</p>
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		<title>By: Thomas Parkin</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/08/13/political-speech-to-believe-in/#comment-43736</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Thomas Parkin]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Aug 2008 00:57:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/?p=4059#comment-43736</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Steve,

It&#039;s not to my point whether or not he was a communist - my point is that he was naive, and that one might perhaps be cautious about jubilation over soaring political rhetoric that champions &#039;the People.&#039; In fact, Chaplin, like many people on the left in his time and even many decades later, sympathized with the USSR out of just that sensibility. There is a long history of naivete on the left that can&#039;t be made to disappear by breathing McCarthy. (I say as someone who categorizes himself as on the left - ameliorative rather than transformative left.)

Here&#039;s a quote from Chaplin at a dinner given in 1942 (wonder how this would sound side by side his Great Dictator speech): &quot;“In those (Stalinist) purges the Communists did away with their Quislings and Lavals, and if other nations had done the same there would not be the original Quislings and Lavals today. The only people who object to Communism and who use it as a bugaboo are the Nazi agents in this country. . . . I am not a Communist but I am proud to say that I feel pretty pro-Communist.”&quot;

It looks like the suspect donations actually took place in the 1920s, and were through a labor leader rather than made directly to Russians. It is much easier to forgive blinkered sympathy with communism in the 1920s than in the 1940s, when information about the Great Terror was available. And much much easier to forgive those sympathies in the 40s to those lingering into the 60s and 70s.

~]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Steve,</p>
<p>It&#8217;s not to my point whether or not he was a communist &#8211; my point is that he was naive, and that one might perhaps be cautious about jubilation over soaring political rhetoric that champions &#8216;the People.&#8217; In fact, Chaplin, like many people on the left in his time and even many decades later, sympathized with the USSR out of just that sensibility. There is a long history of naivete on the left that can&#8217;t be made to disappear by breathing McCarthy. (I say as someone who categorizes himself as on the left &#8211; ameliorative rather than transformative left.)</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s a quote from Chaplin at a dinner given in 1942 (wonder how this would sound side by side his Great Dictator speech): &#8220;“In those (Stalinist) purges the Communists did away with their Quislings and Lavals, and if other nations had done the same there would not be the original Quislings and Lavals today. The only people who object to Communism and who use it as a bugaboo are the Nazi agents in this country. . . . I am not a Communist but I am proud to say that I feel pretty pro-Communist.”&#8221;</p>
<p>It looks like the suspect donations actually took place in the 1920s, and were through a labor leader rather than made directly to Russians. It is much easier to forgive blinkered sympathy with communism in the 1920s than in the 1940s, when information about the Great Terror was available. And much much easier to forgive those sympathies in the 40s to those lingering into the 60s and 70s.</p>
<p>~</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Steve Evans</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/08/13/political-speech-to-believe-in/#comment-43735</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Steve Evans]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 23:04:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/?p=4059#comment-43735</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Adam, why should you feel embarrassed for Chaplin&#039;s sincerity?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Adam, why should you feel embarrassed for Chaplin&#8217;s sincerity?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: Adam Greenwood</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/08/13/political-speech-to-believe-in/#comment-43734</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Adam Greenwood]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 22:59:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/?p=4059#comment-43734</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I watched it and felt embarrassed for Chaplin because he seemed so sincere.  Of course the Holocaust intervened between then and now.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I watched it and felt embarrassed for Chaplin because he seemed so sincere.  Of course the Holocaust intervened between then and now.</p>
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		<title>By: Mark IV</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/08/13/political-speech-to-believe-in/#comment-43733</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Mark IV]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 22:57:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/?p=4059#comment-43733</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[An interesting quirk of Utah political history is that Utah Republican senator Arthur V. Watkins (an alumnus of BYU and U of Columbia law school) was the chair of the Senate committee that had the responsibility to investigate McCarthy&#039;s activities and to decide if those activities merited censure.  During one of the hearings, McCarthy&#039;s temper and combativeness got the best of him, and he berated Watkins personally.  Watkins responded by having him expelled from the hearing, to McCarthy&#039;s great surprise.  He had become accustomed to everybody backing down.

That might be one of the earliest documented uses of the ban stick.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>An interesting quirk of Utah political history is that Utah Republican senator Arthur V. Watkins (an alumnus of BYU and U of Columbia law school) was the chair of the Senate committee that had the responsibility to investigate McCarthy&#8217;s activities and to decide if those activities merited censure.  During one of the hearings, McCarthy&#8217;s temper and combativeness got the best of him, and he berated Watkins personally.  Watkins responded by having him expelled from the hearing, to McCarthy&#8217;s great surprise.  He had become accustomed to everybody backing down.</p>
<p>That might be one of the earliest documented uses of the ban stick.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Steve Evans</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/08/13/political-speech-to-believe-in/#comment-43732</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Steve Evans]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 22:43:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/?p=4059#comment-43732</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[zing!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>zing!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Walt</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/08/13/political-speech-to-believe-in/#comment-43731</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Walt]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 22:30:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/?p=4059#comment-43731</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[And what caliber did you have in mind?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And what caliber did you have in mind?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Steve Evans</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/08/13/political-speech-to-believe-in/#comment-43730</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Steve Evans]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 21:59:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/?p=4059#comment-43730</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hey, everybody deserves a shot, Brad!  I wonder who did Chaplin&#039;s.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey, everybody deserves a shot, Brad!  I wonder who did Chaplin&#8217;s.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Brad</title>
		<link>http://bycommonconsent.com/2008/08/13/political-speech-to-believe-in/#comment-43729</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Brad]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Aug 2008 21:40:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.bycommonconsent.com/?p=4059#comment-43729</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[ETB did Sen McCarthy&#039;s temple work for him.  An old (now dead) friend of mine, a Bircher with heaps and heaps of documents and books all around his house, once showed me photocopies of the temple papers certifying the completed ordinances, evidently disseminated by Steve Benson.  They looked legit.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>ETB did Sen McCarthy&#8217;s temple work for him.  An old (now dead) friend of mine, a Bircher with heaps and heaps of documents and books all around his house, once showed me photocopies of the temple papers certifying the completed ordinances, evidently disseminated by Steve Benson.  They looked legit.</p>
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